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Bush signs new energy bill...........

  • #21
Not only do trucks get bigger every year, but at least where I live...EVERYONE has one. Let me put it this way: if your family has less than 4 people, you work construction, or on a farm....you DO NOT need a truck. If all these stupid kids around here stopped getting huge trucks for compensations sake, maybe gas wouldn't be $3 a gallon...

Exactly! I was talking about how everyone had one, not that euro cars were appropriate for my area.
 
  • #22
We have a Ford F 250 and are a family of three. None of us work!

Diesel! Aahahahahahaha
 
  • #23
It would be sweet if all the scientists that actually got more than the godawful 2-3% efficiency out of internal combustion engines stopped getting assassinated and their work stolen/destroyed. Gotta run right now, but 2 good stories in an hour or so.
 
  • #24
We've got homeless people though. Gotta have good suspension for them.

Well played, sir!
 
  • #25
Ok, as I said...

Back in the early to mid-60s, there was a new body style of Suburban that came out, and quit ea few people from this area bought them. As was the norm with humongous, heavy, carburated cars, everyone that had them with the 454 was reporting about 7-9mpg, which was how it was "supposed" to be. One Lubbock area local was reporting around 40mpg with a 454 (7.4L). Of course, no one believed him, and he was made to prove it to reporters, etc, which of course he did. Word got around that his car was actually getting 40mpg, and so did the consequences. One day his wife took the car to the grocery store, and came out to see people surrounding the car. She figured peopel were just looking at since it had become well known locally, but when she got up to it, there were a bunch of guys in white GM labcoats messing around under her hood. She of course freaked out, and they told her that it was an experimental carburetor, and wasn't supposed to ever leave the factory. They replaced her "experimental" carb with a normal one, and took off. True story...it was in the paper and everything. I know some older locals who saw the article and knew about the car when it was around. If we could get 40mpg off a CARBURATED SUBURBAN...in the 1960s...why is the national average still what...23mpg?

Also, there used to be a rancher around here that invented a device that pulled water from the air. He didn't have any scientific background, so he made it all out of stuff that was easily obtainable, and obviously easy to build. He built a couple, and had them hooked up to his water troughs so he didn't have to fill them. THe devices would just pull water out of thin air so to speak (and we only have about 15% humidity here, if that), and totally fill the troughs with water. His inventions were reported on, and well known about in the area (LOTS of ranchers wanted them), and the guy put in patents and everything. Then he "mysteriously" disappeared, even though he wasn't mentally ill, had no enemies, and absolutely no reason to run or kill himself. His family went to check on him and all his stuff was still around, but he wasn't, and of course his devices "mysteriously" disappeared as well.


Ahhh corruption. I'm ready for aliens to come and kill all the people that put a halt to human progress. We could be living in a much greener and much more efficient world...but when an extremely small amount of people have an unnecessarily large amount of money to gain, well you know the rest....
 
  • #26
Not only do trucks get bigger every year, but at least where I live...EVERYONE has one. Let me put it this way: if your family has less than 4 people, you work construction, or on a farm....you DO NOT need a truck. ..

Wrong..
my family is two people..myself and my wife.
We do not work in construction, or on a farm.

I never wanted a pickup truck, never cared for them, never wanted to own one. (my ideal vehicle is a Ford Mustang) but I have a small truck now because my wifes parents gave us one..(My wife's mom cant drive anymore, so they had no need for two vehicles..)

the context:

For the past 10 years I drove a 2-door Honda Civic.
For the past 10 years my wife has driven a 2-door Chevy Cavalier.
both have very small trunks, and its not easy to get things in and out of the rear seats.

We got married 2 years ago, bought a house one year ago.
(the first 6 months of owning our house we did not have the pickup truck)
We like to garden.
Bringing home mulch and topsoil in a 2-door coupe isnt terribly handy.
We were loading mulch into 5 gallon buckets in the trunk..
I had to buy a lawnmower when we bought the house..I had to have a friend with a pickup truck meet me at Sears to bring it home..I could not fit the lawnmower box into any orifice of a 2-door Honda Civic.

Since we were given the truck, I have used it to carry mulch, topsoil, fences, lawnmowers, small trees and bushes, and firewood..all things that we had no way to move with two coupes..the truck is VERY handy to have!

so you can take your self-righteous "you DO NOT need a truck."
and shove it..

I hate it when people tell others what they can and cant do.. so annoying.

Scot
 
  • #27
Back in the early to mid-60s, there was a new body style of Suburban that came out, and quit ea few people from this area bought them. As was the norm with humongous, heavy, carburated cars, everyone that had them with the 454 was reporting about 7-9mpg, which was how it was "supposed" to be.


really.............as far as i know the 454 came out in 1970..............
 
  • #28
@rattler, perhaps it was the 427. I get the big blocks mixed up. I drove small blocks in HS :D. Still though, not too much better gas mileage on the 427 than 454. I'll ask my neighbor the dates next time I see him. He's been in Lubbock since the 50s, and he's the one that told me the story in the first place.


Maybe you should've swapped your micro car for something like a Chevy Malibu Maxx. I drive a normal Malibu. It has pretty much all the room I could ever need, and I still get 27mpg in the city.

so you can take your self-righteous "you DO NOT need a truck."
and shove it..

I hate it when people tell others what they can and cant do.. so annoying.
So how do you hate something you just did yourself? Gawd some people do not possess logic or rational thought at all.
 
  • #29
going to say hell the 454 wasnt even availible in the Suburban till the mid 70's
 
  • #30
actually you must be confused on your vehicles or your dates.........cant find anything in a Suburban above a 350 until the 70's
 
  • #31
So how do you hate something you just did yourself? Gawd some people do not possess logic or rational thought at all.

wow..thats so witty and clever.
I haven't heard the "I know you are but what am I?" argument since 2nd grade. :hail:

so if your point is soundly defeated, just ignore the topic completely and instead respond with a weak attack on some totally irrelevant thing your opponent said..
nicely done.

Scot
 
  • #32
IDK I'll ask him tomorrow. I know I've got the vehicle right, I'm probably confused with dates. Either way, if it happened in the 70s, that's still amazing. Real answer tomorrow :D

Scotty...really. Are you going to pull another one of your episodes where you kick and scream like a toddler, shout at people, and ramble on? Let's just let this go...I've got way more important things to do than waste my time on you. :D
 
  • #33
actually you must be confused on your vehicles or your dates.........cant find anything in a Suburban above a 350 until the 70's

It's really simple you see... thanks to natural selection and speciation the 350 evolved into the 454. It just wasn't classified as the 454 until the 70's.
 
  • #34
Scotty and PK - please keep to the topic at hand. As Don Corleone said often enough: this is business, not personal.

xvart.
 
  • #38
There are so many alternative ways to obtain energy.

Solar energy can be obtained in one place and transmitted to other locations via power lines or even advanced AC power transmission. On Edison's deathbed, he said one of his greatest regrets was pursuing DC instead of AC power (even though he ostracized Tesla for it).

Energy from plant cellulose is a very viable alternative, however right now the returns on the energy are not very significant. We need better technology, but fat chance for that to happen with the monopolistic hold of oil companies and OPEC. We can obtain Ethanol in greater efficiency (much more per acre) with plants other than corn, yet corn is the only one receiving press coverage. A big problem with growing our fuel source however, is the amount of water being used to do so. We are decimating our natural balance by diverting vast amounts of water for inefficient agriculture.

We can get energy from windmills, both inland and offshore. This is currently being used in Southern California to a degree, but there is simply not enough.

We can get energy from heat, using Stirling engines. A Stirling engine is a very basic engine that uses a heat differential to expand gas, turn a piston, cool and compress the gas, and repeat the process. All you need to operate the engine, is a heat source. You can use the sun, you can use residual heat from manufacturing plants, water, anything where there is more heat than ambient room temperature. Obviously with something like a manufacturing plant, the residual heat is used more as a means to reduce energy loss through heat, rather than replace convential energy methods. This is a step in the right direction, as the concept is very similar to hybrid cars. Otherwise wasted energy is harnessed, and turned back into useful energy.

In a related energy gathering effort, offshore devices (which the name eludes me) use the heat differential of water surface temperature to the much cooler water temperatures a few meters below. This difference also allows the operation of a Stirling-type engine, only with a huge efficiency margin due to the degree of the heat differential. This is currently being used in other countries, a major one of which is either Greenland or Iceland (can't recall). One of those countries uses almost 100% natural, renewable energy.

Oh yea btw, Stirling engines have a much higher efficiency than Solar panels. A new method however, is to use mirrors to focus the energy of a greater surface area onto a smaller solar panel, to limit the amount of raw materials needed for the solar panel.
 
  • #39
Someone mentioned earlier in this thread how these improved fuel standards help the oil companys..

Im certainly not in favor of these ridiculous new standards,
but how does improved fuel economy *help* the oil companys?

the myth has been around for 40 years that "Car companys could build cars with much better fuel effeciancy, but they dont because the oil companys are so powerful and the oil companys want us to burn as much gas as possible..we could be driving around in cars getting 70 miles to the gallon if not for the oil companys"

Im not one for conspiracy theorys..but I have to admit I could buy into that one..

seems better fuel mileage would hurt oil companys, not help them..
the last thing they want is better fuel economy.

thoughts on that?

thanks,
Scot
 
  • #40
on solar..................how do you guys pushing this really expect it to do lots of good?in its current form its about worthless for powering things large scale unless your willing to destroy habitat and blanket the american west with Solar panels. IIRC there are about 20 some permits working their way through the system to build nuclear power plants. nuclear power plants have the potential to produce more energy from a handfull of acres versus mile upon mile upon mile of solar panels.

as far as high mpg out of vehicles......its an easy process. reduce weight. look at motor cycles. however just how much weight are you willing to loose and how much are you willing to pay for it. light and cheap is easy but you sacrifice safety......safe and light is easy but you sacrifice economically priced. you can build a fly weight safe car that gets 70mpg off gas but who can pay for it? as far as claiming 70mpg out of a "super secret experimental" carborator......i have to call bull chit.......all a carb does is mix air with fuel.....just changing out a carb, i dont care how special it is, is not going to take you from 9mpg to 70mpg. a completely different engine? ill buy that. but a special carb? no way.
 
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