Opinions on Standing Water for Droseras

[summit]

Hello,

I recently got back into the hobby after I saw this thread and instantly wanted to create something similar. The only real question that I have is, is it okay to keep the whole tank submerged in about 1-2" of water without any movement for the water. I mostly want to make it a Drosera tank and have Capensis and other South African species flourish in it. I've read countless threads on all types of forums saying you need false bottoms and must change the water monthly but after reading the thread above it seems like everything took well to the standing water. Or would it be a better option to have everything in separate trays just on a shelf?

Thanks,
Justin

 

[Zath]

The only issue I can see with planted tanks is the difficulty in removing / changing water (if needed). Otherwise, standing water (even stagnant) is perfectly fine for most tropical / subtropical 'dews. If you can discipline your watering sufficiently, a planted tank can work. Otherwise, use the tray method. That's my $.02, at least.

 

[SubRosa]

Depending upon the size of the tank, it might be worthwhile to consider drilling it for drainage or having it done. If the tank is easy for you to pick up and dump, do it. But on a larger tank a well placed hole with a bulkhead fitting, plumbing to drain excess water to a convenient location, and perhaps a valve will make your growing much more enjoyable. Drilling glass is tedious but really not that difficult, and any glass shop and many better aquarium stores can drill a hole as long as the glass isn't tempered. Which might be something to consider if you haven't gotten your tank yet.

 

[summit]

I decided to go with the tan, mostly because I already purchased it and have already done shelf keeping but never a terrarium. I got it all planted up today with the three plants I have as of now. (D. Spatulata, D. Capensis Red Leaf, and Pinguicula Aphrodite) To keep the Ping out of standing water I stacked a few river stones in a corner and filled the lower area of the stones with perlite to help drainage and then the top layer with silica sand, if I can find a nice piece of pumice rock I'd rather have it planted into that then the ground. Everything else is 50/50 peat and perlite with about a inch of standing water. As for lighting I'm testing out some compact fluorescent bulbs, if it doesn't suffice then I will be moving to a t5 strip. As for now they're being hit with a 5000k 40w 2600 lumen bulb that's about 6 inches from the plants. I've never really understood indoor lighting for these plants so this might take a little to get down. As for what I want for the tank is to be a sundew paradise and have them carpet the tank and moss on the wood with the Aphrodite tucked in the corner. I do have a question of what moss would you recommend for this enclosure? I know sphagnum is the go to for CP growers but my only concern is that I have no open standing water for the moss and I'm concerned about it overtaking the dews and chocking them out, especially gemmae. And as for the last question what are some other dews I can house? I plan on adding the other varieties of Capensis.

Thanks,
Justin

 

[PhilipS]

The only issue I can see with planted tanks is the difficulty in removing / changing water (if needed). Otherwise, standing water (even stagnant) is perfectly fine for most tropical / subtropical 'dews. If you can discipline your watering sufficiently, a planted tank can work. Otherwise, use the tray method. That's my $.02, at least.

You can always pull back the substrate with a styrene sheet and add stones all the way down to the bottom. Which ever size you choose, is best. Then it's easier to push an acrylic airline tube connected to airline hose to syphon out the water.

Looks better when plants aren't growing up the side of the tank.

 

[summit]

You can always pull back the substrate with a styrene sheet and add stones all the way down to the bottom. Which ever size you choose, is best. Then it's easier to push an acrylic airline tube connected to airline hose to syphon out the water.

Looks better when plants aren't growing up the side of the tank.

Hopefully by the time I need to completely clean out the water in the tank I'll have another want or need to change the whole idea of the tank around, or if it all goes downhill...

 

[Zath]

(Another $.02...let's just call it a nickel)

A 40-watt equivalent CFL isn't going to be enough. I wouldn't try this without at least a 100-watt equivalent, 150 if I could get it in the same color temp (5000 should be fine).

The soil also looks too wet for the ping, despite the considerations you've made for it. It looks like you've only got about 3" of soil in the tank as is, but the ping should ideally be mounded up even further if you're keeping a full inch of water-table. Just having that much peat on the surface is going to bring a ton of water to it.

 

[summit]

(Another $.02...let's just call it a nickel)

A 40-watt equivalent CFL isn't going to be enough. I wouldn't try this without at least a 100-watt equivalent, 150 if I could get it in the same color temp (5000 should be fine).

The soil also looks too wet for the ping, despite the considerations you've made for it. It looks like you've only got about 3" of soil in the tank as is, but the ping should ideally be mounded up even further if you're keeping a full inch of water-table. Just having that much peat on the surface is going to bring a ton of water to it.

The packaging for the cfl says it's equivalent to a 150w incandescent bulb... Does this mean I need a 150w cfl? As for the Ping with your comment I'll definitely make it a priority to find that pumice rock and get it out of the peat ASAP.

 

[Zath]

Ah, I thought you were saying that it was a 40-watt equivalent CFL. Combined with the way the picture looks (really, really dim), made me think you needed a brighter bulb. Try it with the one you have and see how things look after a couple-three weeks.

 

[summit]

Ah, I thought you were saying that it was a 40-watt equivalent CFL. Combined with the way the picture looks (really, really dim), made me think you needed a brighter bulb. Try it with the one you have and see how things look after a couple-three weeks.

That would be my fault, I tilted the lamp while getting overhead pictures! I'll keep an eye on them, I took some pictures so I can compare after the weeks go on. Any chance you might have some recommendations on some more dews for these conditions? Preferably pygmies.

 

[Zath]

Sorry, but I'm not well-versed in pygmy's. Since you're growing capensis and spatulata, however, you have a wide range of options as far as sub-tropical and tropical 'dews, most of which are easily obtainable through trades (or even through simply asking. Many people have extras of these they're itching to get rid of, lol).

 

[summit]

Sorry, but I'm not well-versed in pygmy's. Since you're growing capensis and spatulata, however, you have a wide range of options as far as sub-tropical and tropical 'dews, most of which are easily obtainable through trades (or even through simply asking. Many people have extras of these they're itching to get rid of, lol).

No worries at all, if not pygmies what's your poison? I took your advice and got the Aphrodite out of the peat and picked up a chunk of lava rock and drilled a hole and planted it in, I've always wanted to do a rock covered in Pings so hopefully I can get watering details with it in the rock ironed out. I wonder how absorbent lava rock is...

 

[summit]

Just a quick update, I finally found a hood that can fit both of the CFLs. With just one bulb I was seeing new growth but no dew on either of the sundews. Both bulbs are rated at 40w (150w equivalent), 5000k, and 2600 lumens. Shoe boxes are temporally until I can fabricate something to hold the hood. I'm a little worried about the Ping, it's show some new growth but slow. I'm worried the lava rock may be absorbing to much water, what are some good signs of to much water with Pings? Humidity is around 55%-60%.

Thanks,
Justin

 

[Axelrod12]

I am working on a similar setup now. Rather than a level planting media I formed a hill to one side and a small aquatic area formed in the front. I can drain and change water from the aquatic area but I don't think it will be very necessary, I water it with only 0-1 TDS RO water.

Keep in mind different planting media for the different types of dews etc. I dug out a pocket in the peat and filled it with turface to plant mexi-pings in. The lava rock should be fine. Just give the ping time to adjust, keep in mind you just transplanted it twice. Pings don't seem to be particularly prone to transplant shock but they can lag behind for a bit.

I'm also giving some pygmy gemmae a try in my setup, I mixed a little extra sand into a somewhat deeper area of the media and put the gemmae there. Pygmies are typically planted in deep pots so a deeper media for them in your setup might be preferred.

If you want a carpeted sorta of look you can try an easy utric like U. livida to fill in gaps, that'll also have the bonus of a nice flower stalk (or 100) here and there.

Also if you dont care how the equipment looks you can try fashioning a DIY reflector for those bulbs.

 

[summit]

I am working on a similar setup now. Rather than a level planting media I formed a hill to one side and a small aquatic area formed in the front. I can drain and change water from the aquatic area but I don't think it will be very necessary, I water it with only 0-1 TDS RO water.

Care to share some pictures? At first I made a small pool but it quickly turned into peat colored water... I'm also using RO water so I'm not to worried about water changes.

Keep in mind different planting media for the different types of dews etc. I dug out a pocket in the peat and filled it with turface to plant mexi-pings in. The lava rock should be fine. Just give the ping time to adjust, keep in mind you just transplanted it twice. Pings don't seem to be particularly prone to transplant shock but they can lag behind for a bit.

Okay thank you for the reassurance!

If you want a carpeted sorta of look you can try an easy utric like U. livida to fill in gaps, that'll also have the bonus of a nice flower stalk (or 100) here and there.

Should I be worried about the Livida taking over the gemmae?

 

[summit]

Small update. I did some reading on humidity and decided that a steady level of 45%-50% even when misted wasn't enough. Luckily my father had some spare 3/8" plexiglass laying around so he fabbed me up a lid.

Lid mapped out so that the ballast would be dead center and so the bulbs would hang inside the tank.




The result was a constant 80% humidity until I mist and then it holds steady at 100% for the whole day. Plant wise everything is starting to come around, the slowest being the D. Spatulata. The Ping is slowly but surely coming along, I've kept about three Pings total and have never had one send up a stalk! And hopefully within the weeks I'll have some new inhabitants to add.

 

[SerMuncherIV]

Small update. I did some reading on humidity and decided that a steady level of 45%-50% even when misted wasn't enough.

I'm not a Ping grower, but for your Drosera species that is more than enough - capensis and spatulata stay dewy for me at 30% RH or even less. Higher humidity has a better chance of causing problems with mold on both the media and the leaves if you ever feed the plants. I'm comparing the older growth on your plants to the newer growth, and it seems that your main issue is light. High humidity is a quick way to get your plants to produce "faux" dew (which is mostly just water anyway), but for the plants to grow best and produce the most dew possible they need sufficient lighting.

 

[summit]

I'm not a Ping grower, but for your Drosera species that is more than enough - capensis and spatulata stay dewy for me at 30% RH or even less. Higher humidity has a better chance of causing problems with mold on both the media and the leaves if you ever feed the plants. I'm comparing the older growth on your plants to the newer growth, and it seems that your main issue is light. High humidity is a quick way to get your plants to produce "faux" dew (which is mostly just water anyway), but for the plants to grow best and produce the most dew possible they need sufficient lighting.

I was worried about that... Do you think it would be worth waiting a few more weeks to see if the lights are actually enough or just go for a higher cfl now? At the moment they're both 150w equivalents.

 

[Axelrod12]

I'll try to get a pic of mine up later. I would let the pygmy gemmae establish then allow other plants to grow in around them. Prune back as needed.

The peaty pool is common. If you try it again soak your peat ahead of time and use the stuff that settles after a few hours. If anything still floats when you flook it in the tank just try to scoop it off the top. I'm also establishing an aquatic utric in there so that keeps the peat settled as well.

40-50% should be fine for pings as well. I agree that it seems the light could definitely be stronger.

 

[SerMuncherIV]

I was worried about that... Do you think it would be worth waiting a few more weeks to see if the lights are actually enough or just go for a higher cfl now? At the moment they're both 150w equivalents.

Your lights seem to be enough to keep the plants in reasonably good health, but if you want to grow them to their full potential you'll need more lighting. Waiting a few weeks won't change anything, the newer green foliage on the (presumably) red-form capensis speaks for itself. If increasing the lighting is inconvenient or isn't worth the investment to you, don't worry about it too much, capensis and spatulata are still unstoppable and will grow well even in lower lighting, they just won't get as much color or dew as they could.