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Nematodes or some larvae?

gill_za

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I just top watered one of my VFT pots that has been showing some yellow leaves lately and slowed growth all of a sudden and as some of the water pooled around the bottom of the pot in a previously dry saucer I noticed that small peat debris in the water are slightly wiggling around. After a bit of concentrated starring i've noticed several millimeter long thin (thinner than hair) worms wiggling around... Some of them get stuck to small peat debris and that is what caught my attention initially

Could these be the nematodes that are causing my VFT the harm? I don't think that these are fungus gnats larvae since the pot was in a dry saucer and these worms are just too thin and small. If they are how do I get rid of them?

I tried taking videos where the wiggling of peat debris can be spotted. Can't see the worms with it though.

Here they are for entertainment purposes:

1) look at thecenter of the video frame
<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="641" height="362" data="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" > <param name="flashvars" value="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=04745a0c3a&photo_id=5660627464"></param> <param name="movie" value="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377"></param> <param name="bgcolor" value="#000000"></param> <param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" bgcolor="#000000" allowfullscreen="true" flashvars="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=04745a0c3a&photo_id=5660627464" height="362" width="641"></embed></object>

2) center but slightly shifted right.
<object type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="641" height="362" data="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377"> <param name="flashvars" value="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=a626887e9b&photo_id=5660626312"></param> <param name="movie" value="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377"></param> <param name="bgcolor" value="#000000"></param> <param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://www.flickr.com/apps/video/stewart.swf?v=71377" bgcolor="#000000" allowfullscreen="true" flashvars="intl_lang=en-us&photo_secret=a626887e9b&photo_id=5660626312" height="362" width="641"></embed></object>
 

GrowinOld

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Hey Gill,

Indeed my eyes aren't as good as they used to be, so your video looked like dirty water
with one piece of dirt moving about a bit!

If it were me, since your VFT has been having a difficult time anyway,
I would remove it from the pot and immediately throw away everything except the VFT!
Then I would run it under the tap with temperate water, to wash it off a bit.
Then let it soak in a cup of clean Rain/R.O./Distilled water for the day.
This should encourage any "bugs" to go-a-swimmin', leaving a nice clean VFT!
I would then pot it up in a new pot with some new mixture.

You could use something else on the plant to kill off anything left, but in my experience,
just cleaning things off real good works just fine,
and avoids using things that may just complicate the issue if not done properly.

Well, that is what I would do, FWIW.
Good Luck
:water:
 

gill_za

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Thank you for the advice. I do realize the videos don't do the justice to the horrors I've seen swimming in that little tray, I pasted them just to make my post less plain :)

I've since have been looking around my custom google search and found few posts here and there where people suggest using imidacloprid containing sprays to poison the little ba****ds. Also neem oil contains azadirachtin so I will attempt to mix this into their diet as well.

If all fails I'll be forced to repot it. My problem is that I will have to repot all my plants because I have definitely contaminated my little collection when I was shifting pots around and swapping them temporarily between the trays...

I'll get the insecticide today and pick the worst looking VFT to test it on. Will try both neem extract and imidoclorpid (hopefully they will not react with each other) together and report back what I find.

P.S. I wonder now why i did not see them before, I suspect that after I initially applied neem, nemathodes migrated deeper into the pot and some got washed out with the last watering.
 
Joined
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Im like Paul, only probably with worse vision LOL

ummm but just for laughs and giggles.... Brownian motion?

CP particle theory woohoo, Ive always wanted to combine the two (Carnivorous unification? LOL)

now my brain hurts really bad
:p
 

gill_za

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Im like Paul, only probably with worse vision LOL

ummm but just for laughs and giggles.... Brownian motion?

CP particle theory woohoo, Ive always wanted to combine the two (Carnivorous unification? LOL)

now my brain hurts really bad
:p

Well If I could see particles down to micron size with my much abused eyes my brain would probably also hurt.
But unfortunately no dice... the theory you proposed will have to be scrapped.. :( Those are worms... and they boogie like this (close enough):

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tp-O3LME3OU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
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plant parasitic ones tend to move sort of slowly. There are free living and ones that eat other nematodes.

<embed width="600" height="361" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowFullscreen="true" allowNetworking="all" wmode="transparent" src="http://static.photobucket.com/player.swf" flashvars="file=http%3A%2F%2Fvid300.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fnn35%2Fkulamauiman%2Fmultimedia%2520clips%2F20110301_202914.mp4">

is a quick and dirty I shot via a microscope and USB2 cam attached to it. infective larvae of a rootknot nematode that was extracted from tomato roots.
 

gill_za

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plant parasitic ones tend to move sort of slowly. There are free living and ones that eat other nematodes.

is a quick and dirty I shot via a microscope and USB2 cam attached to it. infective larvae of a rootknot nematode that was extracted from tomato roots.


Well maybe the ones I got are hyperactive from all that neem oil extract I dumped into the pots previously...
What about the human parasitic ones? Do they move fast?

/me crosses his fingers and mutters really fast: "i hope i myself wont get any worms after this, i hope i myself wont get any worms after this....."
 

Not a Number

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Nothing significant can be made of your videos.

I'd be a bit more cautious when "dumping" chemicals or insecticides on my plants, especially when mixing stuff that is not normally sold or found as mixtures. Just because Neem Oil is "organic" it doesn't mean it can have harmful effects on plants or humans. Yeah, it's "organic" or "natural', so what? Hydrogen Cyanide can be derived from peach or grape seeds. Does that make it (in enough concentration) any safer?

In Barry Rice's "Growing Carnivorous Plant" it was mentioned that when he treated plants in a terrarium with Imidacloprid it killed the worms in the medium. Even though he was most likely talking about earthworms (annelids). Oh the Horror...the Horror...growing CPs in a terrarium! Well he didn't actually say they were CPs but in a book about Carnivorous Plants...
 

gill_za

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Not a Number,

Thanks for the reply. Yes I realize that not much can be seen from that video. Unfortunately the camera that I have is not as sensitive as I'd hope it to be. As I mentioned several times I included those clips just for entertainment purposes. My apologies in case you feel that it was not appropriate for me to do so.

Also as I mentioned previously I selected one of the plants to be a test subject to the treatment I'm trying to administer and thus I am not worried if it will not survive it. The chances of the Imidacloprid and Cyfluthrin reacting with the components of Neem Oil extract lingering in the pots after top watering are close to those of them reacting with bacterial and insect metabolites and other chemicals already present in the peat. So I will take that chance. And yes, "organic" doesn't mean anything to me but the fact that the compound either was derived from organic matter or involves chemistry of carbon based compounds. In short it is too broad of a definition.

Regarding "Growing Carnivorous Plant", your original post from 2008 was what gave me the idea about imidacloprid. So thank you for that! Search works :)

P.S. Any other time I would not even bother with this kind of a pest control. But this time I have two plants which exhibit similar signs of withering. Those worms (nematodes or whatever they might be) could be beneficial insects and by killing them I could be opening the gates for other pathogens or insects to fill the niche. This is a risk I realize it and I would not attempt this if the plants looked healthy to me.
 

gill_za

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Here is one washet out from butterwort pot in another container. As I suspected I have an infestation across several plants :

<iframe width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ajpWuibP5J0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I sprayed some imidacloprid into the tray and it is barely moving now 10 minutes later.

Update 30Apr2011:
I was pretty sleepy yesterday and did not notice the way it moves. It extends and contracts its own body which means that it is not a round worm. Suspect that this little worm is just a baby earthworm washed out from my pot. It is still alive from imidocloprid treatment anyway.

Update 09May2011: After trying several treatments I still see little white worms in the water from the plants.
 
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