Mini-Bogs in Vegas?

[Josh Gertz]

Hey everyone...its been awhile for me. About two years ago I made the move from Phoenix to Vegas with a little delay while I finished a contract, during that time though my wife didn't have a lot of time to care for the plants and they died by the time I made my way back home.

Ive been holding off getting back into Carnivores until I had the time, money and space...well its that time again. Previously I didn't have backyard space so I grew indoors under lights but now I have a half acre to use. Ive gotten a few trees and my wife and I are using about a third of the yard for a garden but there is a lot of space left and that itch isn't being filled by corn and pumpkins.

I would like to grow outdoors in planters similar to Brokkens mini-bogs but I am worried about the heat here in Las Vegas, there are days when it gets to 110+ and the off chance of a 120+ day, its not really the sun that worries me...its the heat and the soil temperature within those planters.

Does anyone here have any experience with similar weather and heat concerns? Throw out a few pointers for me going from indoor to outdoor?

BTW, I would mainly be growing Sar's and VFTs with a fe Dews possibly

-Josh

 

[sarracenia_X]

place the container in a spot where the carnivores get enough sun, but the actual container is shaded, maybe by placing leafy plants/ ornamental grasses in smaller containers surrounding the central mini-bog container. oh, and don't ever try to grow cobras in the bog. THEY WILL GET COOKED!!!!

 

[mass]

After living in Vegas for 6 years I'd say go with an in-ground bog, or grow indoors.
An in-ground would help to keep things moist & cool. And wouldn't dry out as fast as above ground pots. And you could easily add water to a drying bog on your designated water use days. Something that would actually retain that moisture a bit. Which a pot really wouldn't do.

 

[Josh Gertz]

place the container in a spot where the carnivores get enough sun, but the actual container is shaded, maybe by placing leafy plants/ ornamental grasses in smaller containers surrounding the central mini-bog container. oh, and don't ever try to grow cobras in the bog. THEY WILL GET COOKED!!!!

Thanks sarracenia_X

I was thinking of a few things...
1. Use Styrofoam Coolers
2. Get larger pots than I need, plant in the center and leave space
3. As above, shade the planters with pots of other items that are more tolerant of the heat

A large portion of my yard next to the house is shaded in the afternoon by 1pm or so, they get direct sunlight during the morning but during the high heat of the day they are shaded, this is where I was going to put the bogs.

 

[Brokken]

My take on it would be to ask someone who grows CPs in the same climate you do and that would be our very own Andrew here on Terraforums. Here's the tricky part: Sarracenias like sunlight - lots of it - so you can't grow them in deep shade like the type you get under a tree (at least, I don't think so). Mass' suggestion of an in-ground pond sounds pretty good for keeping things cool and watered. Maybe a possibility might be to build it to parts of it are in shade and the portion with the sarracenia in the light. Even so, I would probably think about some kind of shadecloth for them. for my GH, I use 75% opacity - but this is neps we're talking about and again, I'm not qualified to comment on weather over there. The times I've been to Vegas it's been hellishly hot outside and I'm of the opinion that you'd be better off providing them with some protection inside a GH. You may wish to consider using the intense Vegas sun to your advantage by purchasing all manner of solar powered devices like solar fans and maybe even an AC unit powered by solar panels since it appears that space is not an issue.

Talk to Andy. I'm sure that he's got experience in the matter.

 

[Josh Gertz]

After living in Vegas for 6 years I'd say go with an in-ground bog, or grow indoors.
An in-ground would help to keep things moist & cool. And wouldn't dry out as fast as above ground pots. And you could easily add water to a drying bog on your designated water use days. Something that would actually retain that moisture a bit. Which a pot really wouldn't do.

Hey Mass

I would love to do an in ground but that's not in the cards right now and I would prefer not to do indoors again because of the two year old running around getting into everything. That and the very large collection of boardgames that takes up most of the extra space that I had before.

My take on it would be to ask someone who grows CPs in the same climate you do and that would be our very own Andrew here on Terraforums. Here's the tricky part: Sarracenias like sunlight - lots of it - so you can't grow them in deep shade like the type you get under a tree (at least, I don't think so). Mass' suggestion of an in-ground pond sounds pretty good for keeping things cool and watered. Maybe a possibility might be to build it to parts of it are in shade and the portion with the sarracenia in the light. Even so, I would probably think about some kind of shadecloth for them. for my GH, I use 75% opacity - but this is neps we're talking about and again, I'm not qualified to comment on weather over there. The times I've been to Vegas it's been hellishly hot outside and I'm of the opinion that you'd be better off providing them with some protection inside a GH. You may wish to consider using the intense Vegas sun to your advantage by purchasing all manner of solar powered devices like solar fans and maybe even an AC unit powered by solar panels since it appears that space is not an issue.

Talk to Andy. I'm sure that he's got experience in the matter.

My in-laws actually owned the largest dry greenhouse in Vegas for some time before retiring in 2009. I would love to have a greenhouse but financially it wouldn't be possible for some time...it is something I have thought about for the future though.

I think I may buy a planter, fill it with medium and keep an eye on the temperature to see how hot it gets during the day...if its over 100 then find a way to cover it with either bricks, another planter with something else in it or some other means.

Thanks for the advice everyone...seems more people are into succulents out here though...I haven't met any CP people yet

 

[sarracenia_X]

...seems more people are into succulents out here though...

there's a good reason for that!

 

[Josh Gertz]

there's a good reason for that!

Its mainly that most of my interaction with people into horticulture are friends of my in-laws and they specialized in them for 30 years here in Vegas.

 

[Josh Gertz]

So, my search for information has uncovered very little to nothing...even some articles saying its still a mystery. So I have some general questions that may help me unravel this a bit more without being to costly upfront...Id like to not kill as much as possible.

Container
- What containers generally stay cooler? Clay, Terra Cotta, Plastic, Ceramic
- Similar question, What material are good at dissipating internal heat?

Soil
- Are there better soils that can be used that suit the above questions? Stay Cool and Cool Quicker or dissipate heat quickly?

I went home for lunch and by 12:15 the sun was already at a point that the backside of my house was casting a shadow where the plants/containers would be.

Thanks again everyone

 

[Steve Booth]

Hi Josh

If you can put a clay pot with you plant in, within another clay pot (both with holes in the bottom) and fill the space between with sphagnum moss or inert wicking material, then stand that in a tray of water you effectively create an evaporative cooler with the heat bing drawn from the inner pot keeping it cool. How much cooler though is a bit of a lottery dependant on ambient temp and humidity but it is definitely cooler.

So I would suggets clay pots, stood in a tray of rainwater with possibly white gravel or similar reflective top dressing on the CP soil and I would stay with the standard mix.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Josh Gertz]

Hi Josh

If you can put a clay pot with you plant in, within another clay pot (both with holes in the bottom) and fill the space between with sphagnum moss or inert wicking material, then stand that in a tray of water you effectively create an evaporative cooler with the heat bing drawn from the inner pot keeping it cool. How much cooler though is a bit of a lottery dependant on ambient temp and humidity but it is definitely cooler.

So I would suggets clay pots, stood in a tray of rainwater with possibly white gravel or similar reflective top dressing on the CP soil and I would stay with the standard mix.

Cheers
Steve

Thanks for the info Steve

Humidity is little to none unless it rains like it did on Wednesday. Ill be testing a few things out this weekend to check general temperatures with different planters at specific spots in the backyard.

 

[Josh Gertz]

Experiment so far...by noon, right before the sun moves behind the house and the planters get shade...these are soil temperatures

Recycled Plastic Pot(6") - 102.2F
Plastic Rectangle Planter(12" long by 6" wide) - 103.3F
Terra Cotta Pot(6") - 98F
Terra Cotta Pot(6") inside a Terra Cotta Pot(8") - 92F

They are on a concrete slab that is creating some ambient heat so if I place them on the dirt the temps will probably be a little lower, or if they were on shelving they would probably be a little lower.

 

[Steve Booth]

Hi Josh

Are the terracotta pots porus? If not the pot in pot with sphagnum or wicking material standing in a tray of water wont work so well as it should, did you stand them in a tray of water or just on the slabs as you say above?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Josh Gertz]

They were in a tray of water.

They stayed wet all day, the tray did dry out by 5pm.