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well, if it's the everyone's rights to own guns then they're part of everyone 
(yeah i'm just nitpicking)
I bet there are plenty of people who think every single person in this country has the right to own a gun. just checking.
(yeah i'm just nitpicking)
I bet there are plenty of people who think every single person in this country has the right to own a gun. just checking.
WolfStriker, you make a very good point. Order needs to be restored. But there was psycho with guns shooting into the refugees, at medical helicopters, etc. If I was stuck there with psycho like that, there is no way I would give up the only way I have to protect myself and my family. If I gave up my gun how can you guarantee my family's safety? Are you going to put an armed guard outside my door 24hrs a day? I agree that order needs to be restored and fast, but my top priority is myself and my family's safety. And thank you for giving your time to help in a very bad situation.
Rattler, where did you get all this info about Bush trying to get the state to sign that document? I'm not saying you're wrong, I just haven't heard anything about that. Only thing I heard that he did was to cut his vacation short the day after the hurricane.
Rattler, where did you get all this info about Bush trying to get the state to sign that document? I'm not saying you're wrong, I just haven't heard anything about that. Only thing I heard that he did was to cut his vacation short the day after the hurricane.
True however they can go to a street corner and buy one real cheap.[b said:
That's not going to stop a felon from getting one. The problem is that the gun laws make it real difficult to buy a gun legally but a convicted felon or whacked out druggie can get one real easy, all they have to do is go to the local drug hangout or street corner and they can get a gun.[b said:
JB_OrchidGuy
Cardiac Nurse
I agree with you Rattler. Why did the mayor not touch any of those busses he had lined up in the bus yard? Saw it on Hanity and Colmes last night. Must have been a hundred busses just in that one location. I wasn't aware they refused to sign the papers!! Now him and the govener are trying to lay the blame on Mr Bush. I accualy was starting to believe some of that rhetoric. Now I;m glad I have some evidence to the contrary. Why did they remove the head of Fema from his post? That looks funny to me. I sepculate that has something to do with the debit cards though and not the initial responce. It would have been far better for those folks to have piled onto busses and been shipped north or even west to get out of the way of the storm instead of piling them all into the superdome. Plus what good is it to make a manditory evacuation and then allow people to stay? That just makes someone else risk their life to get you out. Also on the gun issue. Even if we were to ban all guns like some of the loones want us to. The crime rate will not go down with guns. Do most of you guys realize that alot of the guns used in crimes were not bought legaly. They were bought on the black market. I could get a gun in a few hours of looking if I wanted one that is illegal. Your never going to get rid of them and if you make it illegal for the law abiding citizens to carry then they will become victoms from those carying illegal firearms.
Ozzy, i got most of the info from an article by a freelance journalist(actually it was basically copied directly). im doing my best to track down any other info i can. but its late and my dialup isnt helping matters at the moment.
As to the removal of the director of FEMA, the guy had no experiance, it was a political appointment. safe to say though his replacement is a solid individual. i wonder what may have been different if he had been heading FEMA instead of Brown?
interesting fact Louisiana recieved $1.9 billion over the last 5 years in projects for the Corps of Engineers. in second place is California with $1.4 billion. now your telling me for $1.9 billion dollars they couldnt strengthan those levys more?(this info is from a washington post article published on Thursday authored by Michael Grunwald, long rticle but i can post it if you wish)
As to the removal of the director of FEMA, the guy had no experiance, it was a political appointment. safe to say though his replacement is a solid individual. i wonder what may have been different if he had been heading FEMA instead of Brown?
interesting fact Louisiana recieved $1.9 billion over the last 5 years in projects for the Corps of Engineers. in second place is California with $1.4 billion. now your telling me for $1.9 billion dollars they couldnt strengthan those levys more?(this info is from a washington post article published on Thursday authored by Michael Grunwald, long rticle but i can post it if you wish)
Perhaps some of you LEOs here can give me the straight scoop on this.
My understanding is martial law has NOT been declared in New Orleans.
Unless martial law has been formally declared in an area;
-No one can be forced from their homes, even if their lives are in danger.
-Legally owned firearms may not be confiscated from a citizen in his home unless he is committing a crime.
-When martial law is declared ALL civil rights of citizens are suspended.
Am I correct on that?
I agree with Ozzy. If the government can guarantee my safety...fine. Until then I will trust in Samuel Colt and Sturm and Ruger.
I agree with Rattler,trying to confiscate weapons from the Blackwater Security guys would make for interesting TV. These are very serious people.
My understanding is martial law has NOT been declared in New Orleans.
Unless martial law has been formally declared in an area;
-No one can be forced from their homes, even if their lives are in danger.
-Legally owned firearms may not be confiscated from a citizen in his home unless he is committing a crime.
-When martial law is declared ALL civil rights of citizens are suspended.
Am I correct on that?
I agree with Ozzy. If the government can guarantee my safety...fine. Until then I will trust in Samuel Colt and Sturm and Ruger.
I agree with Rattler,trying to confiscate weapons from the Blackwater Security guys would make for interesting TV. These are very serious people.
Here's more perspective on the sequence of events - http://www.alternet.org/story/25227/.
By the way, if "Blackwater Security guys" are so poorly trained that they'd refuse to hand their weapons to actual law enforcement officers, then the company cannot be allowed to have weapons. Not M-16's, not super soakers. At the first sign of trouble from one them, the corporate officers better be flying there to personally disarm them or the company needs to be shut down. Don't glorify the mercenaries.
This isn't an action movie; this is real life and people have been shooting law enforcement officers and others who are trying to fix problems. So, if it's necessary to temporarily disarm people to restore some sanity, so be it. I was an NRA member before some of you gun fetishists were born, but I grew up and got out.
By the way, if "Blackwater Security guys" are so poorly trained that they'd refuse to hand their weapons to actual law enforcement officers, then the company cannot be allowed to have weapons. Not M-16's, not super soakers. At the first sign of trouble from one them, the corporate officers better be flying there to personally disarm them or the company needs to be shut down. Don't glorify the mercenaries.
This isn't an action movie; this is real life and people have been shooting law enforcement officers and others who are trying to fix problems. So, if it's necessary to temporarily disarm people to restore some sanity, so be it. I was an NRA member before some of you gun fetishists were born, but I grew up and got out.
When I started my first electrical job 13 years ago my supervisor asked me a question that I'll never forget. He asked "Who is the first person that is responsible for my safety." The answer is me. It all boils down to one point. You can't trust the city, state, or Federal government to look out for your best interests. You have to do it yourself. You can't wait until the city tells you to get on a bus, if you're in danger do whatever it takes to get yourself out. I know they were poor and didn't have money, but like I said, you can't depend on somebody else.
Somebody asked about the mandatory evacuations. I've been through them many times. A mandatory evacuation means that everybody has to be off the streets. Of co use they want you to leave your home, but there is no law that can require you to leave your own property. If you stay they can arrest you if you are off your property. If you do leave the area they won't let you back in. They use scare tactics to try and get people to leave. They go around to the people that stay and tell them that they are on their own and there will be no help for them if they get into trouble. If that don't work they then ask for the people next of kin so they can be notified if they are killed. So mandatory evacuations does not mean than everybody has to leave.
Somebody asked about the mandatory evacuations. I've been through them many times. A mandatory evacuation means that everybody has to be off the streets. Of co use they want you to leave your home, but there is no law that can require you to leave your own property. If you stay they can arrest you if you are off your property. If you do leave the area they won't let you back in. They use scare tactics to try and get people to leave. They go around to the people that stay and tell them that they are on their own and there will be no help for them if they get into trouble. If that don't work they then ask for the people next of kin so they can be notified if they are killed. So mandatory evacuations does not mean than everybody has to leave.
Oh and another thing, you can't trust the media to give you a clear picture of what's going on. New Orleans got the weak side of the storm. Miss. and Al. got the worse of it, but there have been very little coverage of that. When NC was devastasted with Hurricane Floyd, My wifes family called and asked if we had hogs floating in our yards, because that was all the media showed in Ohio where they live. With all the people struggling to survive they just report floating hogs.
There is another storm that is perdicted to hit us on Monday. Thank goodness it's just a baby hurricane, but so was Katrina until she got into the warm waters of the gulf. Since Ophila is slow moving it could get into the gulf stream and explode into a major storm like Katrina did. Most storms that hit NC increase in size just before they hit because they cross into the warm gulf stream that is just offshore. I'm sure it will happen somewhat with this storm but I don't see it turning into a mojor event.
My first Hurricane since I've been home.
There is another storm that is perdicted to hit us on Monday. Thank goodness it's just a baby hurricane, but so was Katrina until she got into the warm waters of the gulf. Since Ophila is slow moving it could get into the gulf stream and explode into a major storm like Katrina did. Most storms that hit NC increase in size just before they hit because they cross into the warm gulf stream that is just offshore. I'm sure it will happen somewhat with this storm but I don't see it turning into a mojor event.
My first Hurricane since I've been home.
Just as soon as the government tries to take our firearms away. Actually we have been figihting our government for over a hundred years to keep our right to bear arms.[b said:
Mercenaries do not have to be glorified. They do the job they are hired for and collect their money. It is a high paying job that has been in existence the beginning of man. Don't knock it till you tried it.
most Blackwater employees make a whopping $200 a day. not exactly good money for what they are doing, nor the kind of pay that buys you experianced employees.
as to when gun owners start shooting back, remember Waco started over the Feds looking to collect a $200 tax. granted alot of otherstuff was going on there but the main justification the feds used to go in there was to enforce the Machine gun, scilencer and any other weapon tax which is a whopping $200. as far as New ORleans goes, i know plenty of ppl who would start shooting any LEO that attempted to take their guns from their private property, only none of the ones i know live in NO.
as to when gun owners start shooting back, remember Waco started over the Feds looking to collect a $200 tax. granted alot of otherstuff was going on there but the main justification the feds used to go in there was to enforce the Machine gun, scilencer and any other weapon tax which is a whopping $200. as far as New ORleans goes, i know plenty of ppl who would start shooting any LEO that attempted to take their guns from their private property, only none of the ones i know live in NO.
There's something wrong in the mind of someone who would shoot a cop rather than turn over guns in an this kind of situation.
There is something wrong in the mind of people that shoot medivac helicopters and into crowds of helpless people. That is the reaosn than the honest people there needs to keep their guns so that those same people don't rob, violent act or kill them.
its not the guns themselves its what they represent. they are protection from anything and everything. in all reality if i am on my property no LEO should have any right to come and take my or anyone elses firearms if they are posing no threat to anyone but tresspassers. by trying to take the firearms away from the individual the LEO is in effect taking away that persons ability to defend themselves which makes the LEO a threat to their well being. Wolf and Bruce, i know you disagree with me on this but its the way i see it. like Ozzy said a manditory evacuation is basically the governments way of declaring the area unsafe, so you have informed everyone that it is not a good idea to stick around, your job is done. if someone wants to stay and protect their property with the understanding that the LEO can not promice any more assistance from any one once he leaves than who cares. the person has been informed of the risks and is on thier own.
A gun only offers protection in a civil society. If the presence of guns prevents police or whoever from stepping in to preserve order, then the legitimate gun owner is in trouble too. Luckily, New Orleans didn't get quite that far.