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Electrical questions

  • Thread starter lithopsman
  • Start date
Hello all,
The peltier cells finally got here today!! Anyways, I hooked one up to a cord that has a plug at one end and raw wire at the other. I did the same thing I did with my CPU fan, where I twisted the wires together (on their respectable sides, of course) and electrical taped. *Note: I have no solderin gun*
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Anyways, I plugged it in for a test run, nothing happened for a sec, and wait for it>>>


POP!!! A little spark and puff of smoke came off of it, and both ends got HOT!!
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Scared the Pee wah diddy out of me! So, I was wondering if it was overpowered, or something else? Also, has anyone used the screw into normal fixture compact flourescents on a timer? The box warned against it, I don't know why... THANKS!!
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I'd say you wired it wrong
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Look on the name plante of the peltier cell and see how many amps it uses. Sounds like the wire in your cord was too small. Let me know the amperage and I'll tell you what size wire to use. By the way I'm an electrician.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> Also, has anyone used the screw into normal fixture compact flourescents on a timer? The box warned against it, I don't know why[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
I have been doing this for years, with no problems.
 
Wow.

Where to begin.

If you would, please re-read my past posts on the very same subject. You should consider yourself quite lucky. You could have very easily started a fire or shorted your home ciriutry.

The short answer is, these devices are meant to run on DC current. The current your home supplies is AC. Now, I won't go into the diffrences at this time, because it can get quite long.

In our previous conversations I advised you to get a good powersupply, now in this instance a bad one would have been better. Its the same reason you have a power supply in your computer. These electrical components need an exact supply of power, something your wall outlet can not supply (hence the reason a lot of your delicate electrical devices such as cordless phones have them big black boxes on the plug).

In short, your fan and pelt are garbage, throw em away.

Next time, please buy a computer power supply. They can be had as cheap as 15 bucks.

Sorry for your loss, but I am glad it wasn't worse.


Casper
 
Hi Lithopsman, I don't know much about peltier cells but something you might want to take into consideration is the type of power that the cell requires, voltage, etc. and your power source. Make sure they're compatible, power cord too.

I am currently using a compact flourescent screw in type bulb on a timer and haven't had any problems with it. I don't understand the warning myself but it may have something to do with the type of ballast.

-Glu
 
I guess that would do it too
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Look on the name plante of the peltier cell and see how many amps it uses. Sounds like the wire in your cord was too small. Let me know the amperage and I'll tell you what size wire to use. By the way I'm an electrician.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


You beat me Ozzy.

MOST pelts are made for DC current, not straight AC. I would bet hard cash that was his mistake. (I have used SEVERAL pelts in water cooling aplications, and every single one used DC current, not AC) Pretty much the same reason you can't hardwire a computer to the wall.


Casper
 
I don't know anything about peltier cells. But I do know wiring. And you can not use ac power to run dc equipment unless you have some type of ac/dc converter, so your explaination sound correct.
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Ozzy

Could you please give us all a short version of Ac vs. Dc so I don't have to look it up for my own curiosity. I do know off head its Direct current vs. (Varriable??) current, and certain components need a very stable line of power. Now, the way I remember it was Ac was like a big wave of power, fluctuating greatly. Whereas DC was a straight line of steady voltage.

Care to offer any insight??

Casper
 
Well direct current (DC) is like you said steady current. Alternating current (AC) is just what it says alternating. THe voltage goes up and down in hertz. In the US we use 60 hertz. That means every second the voltage goes up and down 60 times.
That's the simplest I can make it. I hope I didn't confuse anybody.
If you have any more questions let me know.
 
  • #10
By the way, I could probably find an old 80mm fan or 2 too send ya to replace the one your fried if you like. For a power supply, I would ask friends and familys. Someone has to have an old crappy computer that hasn't been used in years laying around. Not the best thing in the world to use, you probably want at least a 350W psu, but it should work.


Casper
 
  • #11
Thanks for the offer casper, but the thing is that the fan still works fine, always has, and yes it is a CPU fan. Also, are you sure that the pelt is totally gone? I spent like $25 including shipping on it, and I also already bought the plug things for both heatsinks (which still haven't gotten here) and both pelts... Now I am really mad/sad with myself for not knowing more about elecrical appliances...
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Thanks for the help!!
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P.S. Besides taking apart a computer, could I get one of those power supplies at Radio Shack or something?
 
  • #12
Yes, Rat shack stocks power supplys, you could probably get one cheaper online though through newegg.com.

As for the pelts, I really couldn't tell you if they are dead or not for sure. Only thing I can tell you is to hook em up to a PSU and find out.

When you get your PSU post here and I will tell you how to jerry rig it. (Modern power supplys are meant to work with computers, thats why you can turn it off with windows. Back in the day you actually had to manually turn off your computer. So... in essence a power supply isn't supposed to work unless there is a computer hooked to it. But there is a very simple work around for this.)


P.S. buy wire nuts


Casper
 
  • #13
If you can find an old AT power supply (the new ones are ATX) then it will be easier to rig for use with your peltier. There are probably a lot of them kicking around, too, if you go to a computer graveyard...

Ditto on that "lucky you didn't do worse damage" thing...

The other important difference between AC and DC that wasn't mentioned (or i missed it) is that typically DC (direct current) devices use small voltages like 12V (thats what your pelt wants) or 5V, while AC devices run on 110V. That's a big difference, and a dangerous one!
 
  • #14
I considered telling him to find an AT power supply, but I really didn't want to confuse him, as you can't buy AT psu's in very many places anymore. The workaround is actually quite simple. You just have to cut 2 wires to the ATX power supply (the big plug that connects to the motherboard for the people that don't know) and splice em together.

By all means though, if you can find one in an old crappy computer then you could save yourself a few dollars.


Enlight ATX 300W P4 Power Supply EN-8304946A - Retail
Specifications:
Intel Certified and AMD recommended
Weight 4 Lbs
Dimensions: 6"W x 3.5" H 5.5" D
MTBF life expectancy : 100,000 hours (11 years & 2 months)
Operating temperature range : 10 to 50 degree C (50 to 122 degree F)
Automatic Fan Speed Control (AFC)
Single sleeve bearing fan

$24.00 at www.newegg.com


If you plan to run 2 pelts on a single psu, you really need to get AT LEAST a 300w psu. Personally, I wouldn't get under a 350, but a 300 should work.



Casper
 
  • #15
Ok, thanks!! This is starting to get a little confusing... Also, I don't know if thishelps it, but I unplugged the second I heard the pop, so it just got like half a second of power. Do you think that that could also run the two heatsink fans? Thanks again!!
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  • #16
Yes, it will run the fans like a champ. If you still have the molex conectors for the fan they would help, but I guess you could hardwire it if you had too.

Breakdown

AT= old computer standard. Basically its the motherboard layout, they standardized the components for the most part (ie size, and ports) basically so you could use it in any "AT" case etc... (really short version)

ATX= the current standard.


The dif. in the power supply is with a newer ATX psu you will have to fool it into thinking it is connected to a motherboard.

An older AT psu you would not have to fool.

BTW: If you decide to order from newegg, do some shopping on there site. The one I listed was the first thing i saw, you may be able to save some coin. They have sold cases with 250W psu's in em for under 20 bucks before.


Casper
 
  • #17
Ok, thanks! Can you please post the info on how to "trick" the power supply? Thanks!!
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  • #18
Score!!!!


20 bucks

linkage: http://www.newegg.com/app....order=1

Fortron ATX350GU 350W HiQ Brand P4/AMD Ready Power Supply - OEM
Specifications:
HiQ 350W ATX12V, W/ Noise Killer, P4/AMD compatible, Input
range 115/230VAC
100% Hi-pot & ATE tested; Approved by UL, CSA and CB
Power Supply Type: ATX12V
Fan(s): Internal 12VDC Sleeve Bearing fan Model#: ATX350GU -OEM Special FedEx Saver Shipping $6.00
 
  • #19
lithops, don't hook burnt peltier to the power supply, that peltier is toast and not recoverable, if connected to a power supply you may damage the powersupply. Peltiers are fairly delicate and have very specific voltage ratings from 5V to 20V or more. You need to find out exactly what the voltage rating is on your peltier chip before hooking it up to any power supply. If your chips are only 10V and you hook them to a 12V computer PS then it will be fried. They also use a large amount of current so make sure you get a good power supply.

Joe
 
  • #20
Joseph,

Could you explain more in detail please? I have used numerous pelts in my time, and I have always wired them straight to my 12V rail. Now, I ALWAYS use a good psu, (backround check, a bad psu maker will rate his watage while runnin tests in a freezer, a good psu maker will rate his wattage in real world conditions)

But honestly, I have never had to put a resistor or a POT in between my 12V rail and my pelt.


Casper
 
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